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*humbugmst3k

Humbug, the Obsessed Avenger
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Communism & Socialism... let's discuss!

Sun Oct 5, 2008, 7:47 AM
  • Mood: Relief
  • Listening to: my fish tank
  • Reading: Kigo fanfics
  • Watching: Top Gear on BBC America
  • Eating: M&Ms
  • Drinking: apple juice
Discussion time here; please chime in.

The following Journal entry started as my reply to someone else's [link] entry... and it sounded like a good topic. Having said that, here goes.

The single major flaw of both Communism and Socialism... dispite the inherent promise of equality each claims to espouse... is that there will ALWAYS be a select few people with MORE than everyone else. More food, power, liberty... you name it. The reality is, by definition, anathema to the concepts of C & S, so I challenge anyone to name a regime that proclaimed to follow either of those philosophies and did NOT fall to the same trap.

... but you probably don't have Internet access do you?

Please consider and comment.

Any stories that I publish here will also be submitted to [link] as they are completed.

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:icona-markov:
Humans are difficult to sate. It is difficult to give up power (if you have it) and it is hard to believe that everyone is just as miserable as you are. (nobody knows the trouble I've seen...)

In a society where everyone contributes what they can and everyone receives what they need, it doesn't take long for the ones who are working hard to realize that they are getting the same amount as those who are not working at all. At that point the society is doomed.

--
Inventor of the Kigoheart [link]

Biting sarcasm is more socially acceptable than biting people: National Sarcasm Society
(Like we need your support.)
:iconkraban:
Exactly, ideas in the regimes are interesting, but naturally utopia, (Orwell or Soljenitsyn). Marx,(who stated himself it was a utopian treaty), came up with, I believe, a very good concept, started pretty well with Lenin, but as usual fell into the wrong hands, as some noticed it s potential in personal gain.
Still, human beings are the way they are, such great power is beyond a single human's understanding.
There are no regimes in history who followed these concepts without adding some kind of democracy to it, and it's become a trend because it seams to work, I personally, in most cases, wouldn’t even call it democracy. Sure, you can always point out bad elements in politics, things to change, nothing is perfect: but you’ll agree that as you say, humbugmst3k, (if that’s what you meant) the poor always seam to lag; it’s a fact that human beings will and cannot be equal for the stated reasons.
Ohh, unless human beings suddenly lose the money, power and personal gain obsession, that‘ll happen…

Ok, I m gonna stop now, this is getting boring even to me.
:iconhumbugmst3k:
I sincerely hope that nothing is getting lost in translation, but while every society has its poor and downtrodden I'm focusing solely on those societies which claim NOT to have any such schizms or castes. There are plenty of bad elements to be found in politics... FAR too many to list here... so I'll avoid open comparisons.
Socialism and communism claim that everyone is equal. That doesn't necessarily mean that all are poor, just that everyone is the same. I suspect that the drive to obtain personal security for ourselves and our family... the purest and most innocent form of greed.. will prevent modern Man from ever achieving the perfect society.

Now... someone out there prove me wrong with successful examples!
And, please, just call me Humbug!

--
I am the Humbug*, and I mean you no harm.
*(Inventor of the Manly Squee)
:iconkraban:
You can easily find examples in a History book, or read the two authors I wrote about, You are however right about the fact that all are not equal but not necessarily poor, and it actually made me pause for a short moment to think about it.
I still state that such a society cannot work without tweaking, and if you seek interesting examples to prove it, since you do seam interested, I encourage you to read such books as Zamiatine's "WE" and and Orwell’s 1984, lol, there would be Zamiatine's gulag archipelago,( you know, the guy who dies recently), but it s fairly long for pure philosophy.
all those books are counter utopia's, I'm sure you 'd like the first two, since you speak of the achieving a perfect society as wanted in those regimes: if I remember well, the goal was to have each member of the society as a cell of the great machine which would be that perfect society, no single man, but a whole.
Yes, I d say to read at least WE, it s a good one.

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